20 second activation time

Scott, that is an interesting set of photos you took. To my eyes, it seems like one should let a new batch of activated MMS (MMSA) sit at least 15 minutes before ingesting the first dose.

Referring to my chart and looking at the two citric acid results, citric acid seems to keep the ClO2 concentration fairly constant after one minute of activation. We know that the MMSA solution will outgas in an open container, (you can smell the ClO2) which is how my tests were done, and it seems the unused citric acid makes up for the loss of outgassed ClO2 by generating more ClO2 from the unused MMSU (unactivated MMS) still in solution.

That would suggest that some unused citric acid & MMSU remains in the MMSA which is disagreeable in some stomachs. So, the MMSA is not fully activated, it would seem. Certainly not at 20 seconds of activation time.

Note that 4% HCl activator gets used up after 60 seconds of activation time and does not continue to produce much ClO2 beyond 60 seconds. It does convert more MMSU into ClO2 than citric acid, but how much MMSU remains in solution?

So, I am sure when ingesting MMSA one is also ingesting some MMSU which may be activated in the stomach. And if citric acid activator was used, some of that will be ingested, too.

Note the terms I used, MMSU & MMSA. MMS is first unactivated (MMSU), then when activated with an appropriate acid becomes activated (MMSA). These two solutions are different chemical solutions and I think should be labeled differently. In other words, MMSU and MMSA are not the same chemical solutions.

If the goal is to produce only ClO2, then making CDS seems like the way to go. And, if the shot glass/overnight method is used, you will have at least 12 hours of activation time to produce a lot of ClO2 in a closed container with little loss of ClO2 due to outgassing.

But, we know that MMSA contains more than ClO2, so using MMSA may be more beneficial than CDS for some purposes.

And now. some are adding MMSU to CDS which is called CDS+. I don't know anything about that new chemical solution other than it is called CDS+.

Hi JB. I'm going to try and summarize what I spent over an hour typing before and losing it all due to this forum automatically logging me out.

1. I like your use of MMSU, MMSA AND MMS because it can be confusing.
2. I downloaded Kerri's book and it looks as though she prefers CD over CDS or even CDS+ at this point but is still trying CDS+
3. CDS+ is adding 20 ml of MMSU to 1000 ml CDS which is equal to .4 drops per 1 ml of CDS
4. .4 drops per ml of MMSU may not be enough to cause stomach upset
5. Since the 20 ml of MMSU is being added to 1000 ml of CDS which will be gradually consumed over a long period of time, it may get activated itself which would help to maintain the CDS+ at a higher PPM because as we know, over time CDS does gradually out-gas.

Thanks for all you do my Genesis 2 Forum friend,

All the best,
Scott

interesting

Thanks Scott for your input. This is interesting work and hopefully more results from testimonials will prove or disapprove the concoctions we come up with!

Yes, Kerri is using the term CD instead of MMS. But by CD she also means chlorine dioxide, I think. Very confusing to me. I will stick with MMSU & MMSA.

I want to do some testing with CDS+ and see what I can find out.

Okay JB. Looking forward to see what you find out.

Scott

Hi Steve and thanks for your more technical explanation of the activation process.

I think the proof is in the pudding, and people like Jim, Amanda Mary, Andreas, Kerri and others are showing us what works for them. Without funding for expensive trials, studies, etc, testimonials are the only way we can learn what works and what doesn't.

Your comments:
"Being bound to the citric acid, the HCl in the stomach will not activate it in the same manner as if it were just MMS alone."
and:
"If we convert all the gas available from MMS1, you may as well just use CDS, as the liquid left behind will have no "active ingredient left""
may give credence to adding MMSU to CDS which is then called CDS+.

Sure, you can use the chart. Glad it is of interest to others!

Hi Steve, thanks for joining the conversation here.

I was hoping Jim had shared his reasoning with the bishops for the current way of making 8x3 (or MMSA as JB13 likes to call it), but I guess not. That’s too bad because it would be nice to know for sure what the logic is behind the current method of making activated MMS. Your insight into how the food industry uses sodium chlorite might give us a clue though, because the numbers that you mentioned are almost an exact match with how we currently activate sodium chlorite – just multiplied by 5:

5% sodium chlorite x 5 = 25% sodium chlorite
10% citric acid x 5 = 50% citric acid

Hummm… that’s pretty much what we’re using now. So maybe Jim is after the Chlorus Acid which, as you mentioned, “will also release gas over a period of time.”

You also wrote, “Being bound to the citric acid, the HCl in the stomach will not activate it in the same manner as if it were just MMS alone.” Is that what happens? Does the citric acid bind to the sodium chlorite? And then the sodium chlorite and the citric acid pass through the stomach lining and into the blood? If that’s how it works, and we then have sodium chlorite in the blood through that process, that would seem to be a very good and advantageous outcome of using citric acid and not using HCL which expends itself very rapidly in the activation process.

However, if it is the case that the sodium chlorite binds with the citric acid, and this is what we want, then it would seem that CDS is a very very different animal than 8x3 (activated MMS or MMSA as JB13 calls it) since it doesn’t have any citric acid in it, or sodium chlorite for that matter.

Now my wife and I have been using MMS long enough to have experience with all 3 methods plus 1 additional of my own: 15x2, 8x3 (or MMSA), CDS and the New 7 Day Fridge MMS:
- What we experienced with the 15x2 method was vomiting by the time we got to 7x2 (actually 7x1 because we were so sick in the morning that we were totally uninterested in taking the evening dose hahaha ).
- With 8x3 (MMSA), we both have had a much better experience but still a little nausea and more nausea (and diarrhea ) if we increased our dosage. Also, this really did seem to help us (and others we gave it to) to overcome whatever sickness we were using it for.
- With CDS, neither of us experienced any nausea at all but also it didn’t seem to help us to overcome sickness and so we eventually stopped using it. I also noticed that I would burp up some of the chlorine dioxide gas as it warmed up in my stomach and was forced out of the water that it was absorbed into.
- With the New 7 Day Fridge MMS (and the old one too) what we experience is no nausea at all, very little burping up of the chlorine dioxide gas and it seems to work better to overcome illness than the 8x3 (MMSA) method, which might just be due to the fact that we can take more of it faster without making ourselves sick. For example, I take the equivalent of 9 activated drops every morning on a totally empty stomach now as a maintenance dose and my wife will take the equivalent of 6 activated drops from time to time, if she feels a cold coming on or something. Currently, we are mixing palm sugar syrup into it which totally covers up the bad MMS taste and actually makes it a pleasure to drink. Another thing that I’ve noticed since doing the 9 drops every morning with the palm sugar syrup is a fairly big increase in energy/stamina. This is fairly easy for me to verify because every workday, about 2 hours after taking those 9 drops of MMS with the palm sugar syrup, I have to walk up 3 flights of stairs to get to the teacher’s room on the 4th floor of the school I teach at here in Indonesia. Before I started taking the 9 equivalent drops of MMS every morning, I would always have to rest after walking up 2 flights of stairs due to being out of breath and because of the muscle burn in my legs. Now though, I don’t have to stop, I’m not out of breath and there isn’t any muscle burn (or just a tiny bit). And then I also seem to just have more energy throughout the entire day.

I think you’re right on with what you said about chlorous acid playing a part in the way MMS works because chlorous acid, being unstable converts into hypochlorous acid (what the body’s immune system uses to fight disease). Here is an excerpt of a Wikipedia article on Chlorous Acid:
Chlorous acid is an inorganic compound with the formula HClO2. It is a weak acid. Chlorine has oxidation state +3 in this acid. The pure substance is unstable, disproportionating to (converting into) hypochlorous acid (Cl oxidation state +1) and chloric acid (Cl oxidation state +5).

So based on the above, it makes sense to me that 8x3 (MMSA) should be the number 1 product in our arsenal against disease because it contains chlorous acid which converts into hypochlorous acid and it also contains chlorine dioxide. And this is all in a mixture that I think is fairly easily absorbed through the stomach and into the blood stream where it can be transported to wherever the disease is in the body.

On the other hand, CDS is simply chlorine dioxide absorbed into water. There is no chlorous acid and therefore there is no hypochlorous acid. It also tends to easily outgas when it gets warm, as it does when it goes into our stomachs, and so then some of the chlorine dioxide gas may be lost through belching.

If we add a little MMS1 (raw sodium chlorite) to the CDS to make what they call CDS+, that small amount will just be slowly converted into chlorine dioxide as CDS is still fairly acidic in nature and the large quantities that people make for themselves is normally used up slowly over time. As we know, raw sodium chlorite put into water, will gradually turn into chlorine dioxide and purify the water. So I think the addition of the small amount of sodium chlorite to the CDS is not really going to help it that much.

I purchased Kerri’s book a couple of days ago and from what I understand in reading it, she still feels that the 8x3 (or MMSA) method is the way to go; it’s what she used to bring 93 autistic children to health, however she is still willing to give the CDS+ a try, just in case it might prove to work better. Based on the reasoning of what I wrote above though, I really do doubt that it will work better than the 8x3 (MMSA) method of making activated MMS to heal disease.

One last thing that I would like to say, and again this is based upon what is written above, you mentioned Steve that, “If we convert all the gas available from MMS1, you may as well just use CDS, as the liquid left behind will have no "active ingredient left””. I don’t think that is true. I think that the “liquid left behind” is a complex mixture of all of those ingredients which contains chlorine dioxide, chlorous acid and probably even hypochlorous acid too, all of which help us to fight whatever diseases we may be dealing with. 8x3 MMS (or MMSA) isn’t just about chlorine dioxide.

Thank you for your input Steve. Because of what you wrote, it caused me to dig deeper and try to understand MMS better. I always appreciate what you have to say and enjoy and learn from your posts on the forum.

May we all be well,

Scott